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NinjaTrader's Learning Curve - Worth The Effort


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  #31 (permalink)
 
Fat Tails's Avatar
 Fat Tails 
Berlin, Europe
Market Wizard
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, MultiCharts
Broker: Interactive Brokers
Trading: Keyboard
Posts: 9,888 since Mar 2010
Thanks Given: 4,242
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It takes a few minutes to test the CPU load of an indicator in replay. I just close all other programs with the exception of NinjaTrader, add a single chart with a single indicator and look what happens.

Test performed on data for ES 09-13 for last Tuesday.

The VWAP that you used: The test could not be performed until the end of the session, because the indicator slowed down my quadcore Xeon processor.




An alternative VWAP which even has 12 plots instead of the 7 plots of the first VWAP. Speed gains are achieved by using a recursive formula and by not calculating the VWAP with every incoming tick. Accuracy is considerably better than for the first VWAP.




This is not for critizing anybody who offers free add-ons for NinjaTrader. But it is just a proof that it is necessary to test every single piece of code that you use. The testing takes a few minutes and this time is well invested. Just download Process Explorer (free from Microsoft website) and watch the CPU load. The pictures are self-explaining.

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  #32 (permalink)
 
Alfalfa's Avatar
 Alfalfa 
Knoxville
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: IB, Kinetick
Trading: Stocks
Posts: 11 since Nov 2012
Thanks Given: 15
Thanks Received: 3


Fat Tails View Post
The VWAP that you installed is one of the worst resource hogs ever. I had tested it with CalculateOnBarClose = false on replay x 500, and that indicator alone managed to slow down the replay session from 3 to 40 minutes per day, when used on a single chart. If you use the VWAP indicator in COBC = false, it will definitely cause a freeze of NinjaTrader.

Do that on several charts, and you need a super computer to avoid the freeze.


Before you use free stuff with NinjaTrader you need to test it!

You will find a lot of free stuff for NinjaTrader. But all these free indicators have not gone through any quality control. You need to test them yourself, before you use them! If you put the free stuff on your PC, don't test it and then blame Ninjatrader, because the free stuff does not work, then this is a bit strange.

The anaCurrentDayVWAP - see download section of this forum - uses a recursive formula to calculate VWAP and bands. It should be something like 50 times faster than the VWAP you used. I still would recommend to set it to CalculateOnBarClose = true to avoid to let it recalculate with every incoming tick.

In my opinion all your problems are related to bad indicators and false settings. If you just clean up your workspace and adjust the settings, everything should be fine.


Thanks Fat Tails for all the helpful info. I deleted the VWAP I was using but after doing a search & manually looking, I don't find the anaCurrentDayVWAP you mentioned. Is it maybe under a different name now?

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  #33 (permalink)
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 Big Mike 
Manta, Ecuador
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Alfalfa View Post
Thanks Fat Tails for all the helpful info. I deleted the VWAP I was using but after doing a search & manually looking, I don't find the anaCurrentDayVWAP you mentioned. Is it maybe under a different name now?

Click his name then "Find Downloads", you'll find it under SessionVWAP.



Mike



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  #34 (permalink)
 
Fat Tails's Avatar
 Fat Tails 
Berlin, Europe
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Alfalfa View Post
Thanks Fat Tails for all the helpful info. I deleted the VWAP I was using but after doing a search & manually looking, I don't find the anaCurrentDayVWAP you mentioned. Is it maybe under a different name now?

It is called SessionVWAP. I just use the prefix ana for all my free indicators.

https://nexusfi.com/download/ninjatrader-7/indicators/674-download.html?view

I recommend that you use as many indicators as possible with settings CalculateOnBarClose = true. This avoids that the calculations are performed with every incoming tick. The VWAP and the bands usually do not change their value a lot between two bars, so there is no need to recalculate with every tick.

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  #35 (permalink)
 
9baller's Avatar
 9baller 
Philadelphia, PA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Multicharts, Ninja Trader
Broker: Mirus/ZF
Trading: CL
Posts: 27 since Jan 2012
Thanks Given: 8
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I had some of these of problems that you all are complaining of in the past....TT sim feed is slow....
once I changed to ZF broker and separated duties with two dedicated machines....no problems since....

I now use MC for charting used to be TS...and NT only for execution....

MC and office etc on core I7....NT on core I5....connect through synergy with one mouse and keyboard....
ZF feed from Mirus....runs without problems

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  #36 (permalink)
 
Alfalfa's Avatar
 Alfalfa 
Knoxville
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: IB, Kinetick
Trading: Stocks
Posts: 11 since Nov 2012
Thanks Given: 15
Thanks Received: 3


9baller View Post
I had some of these of problems that you all are complaining of in the past....TT sim feed is slow....
once I changed to ZF broker and separated duties with two dedicated machines....no problems since....

I now use MC for charting used to be TS...and NT only for execution....

MC and office etc on core I7....NT on core I5....connect through synergy with one mouse and keyboard....
ZF feed from Mirus....runs without problems

Cool, thanks 9baller - I had not heard of Synergy. I currently use 2 computers...so will give it a try.

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  #37 (permalink)
 
Alfalfa's Avatar
 Alfalfa 
Knoxville
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: IB, Kinetick
Trading: Stocks
Posts: 11 since Nov 2012
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bd92154 View Post
It can be frustrating, and I wish you the best in getting your Ninja Trader working properly.
There are all sorts of performance things we can suggest, but we aren't you and we don't know your trading setup.

One thing that may help is to think of NinjaTrader (NT7) as an erector set. (okay showing my age) If you remember the old erector set commercials they showed people making all sorts of great structures and it all was packed into a 60 second commercial. We see NT7 demostrated and think we will be able to trade like the person showing us NT7 in a short period of time. Truth is it will probably take more than six months.

The manual for NT7 is 999 plus pages and well worth reading. (Also watching and doing the tutorials as well.) Since I want to learn how to autotrade I am also working on learning C# programming. Been using NT7 for over two years now and still learning, and I have a lot to learn.

In a couple of clicks we will have you to the NT7 performance issues here is a link to Online Manual:
NinjaTrader Version 7
To get to the Performance Tips click on CONTENTS and then the dropdown/book labeled configuration, and then performance tips. When you are in performance tips there will be Tips for (Charting, Lagging Market Data, Market Analyzer, Miscellaneous, NinjaScript, Time & Sales, Workspaces) At a minimum I would recommend reading them all.

Even with the perfect NT7 setup there are times when one or more charts will "freeze-up." You will find this happens much less frequently once you have optimized your setup. There are different things you can do to un-freeze your chart and sometimes that will goof up other things. Personally I have found loading a different instrument and then coming back to my original instrument is usually the fastest fix for me. By the way if you use that fix be sure to un-LINK before you do, especially if you link to Time and Sales. I follow Time and Sales on the ES and will lose history of Time and Sales if the T&S is changed.

Okay you've made it to OZ and just have to click your ruby slippers three times and say "There is nothing better than a working platform," and your wish will be granted.

p.s. Lastly for other platforms. If you do a lot of analysis going back and forth between stocks, etc., I have found it best to use another platform for that. You were talking shorter term time frames, maybe try the ones offered by Interactive Brokers. I use TDAmeritrade TOS in addition to my NT7 for both analysis and trading. NT7 for trading.

p.s.s. Unexplained trade executions. To answer that more information would be needed, but after really learning the ins and outs of NT7 you will be able to figure that one out. If you are using ATM strategies there are many ways that the trades can trigger for both Profit and Stop Loss that may not make sense on first read.

Wanted to say thanks for the advice. I'm digging in to the manual & there sure is a lot of it. It's good to know others have had some of these issues & that there is light at the end of the tunnel. NT has great potential.

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  #38 (permalink)
 
bd92154's Avatar
 bd92154 
San Diego
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader/Think or Swim
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Alfalfa View Post
Wanted to say thanks for the advice. I'm digging in to the manual & there sure is a lot of it. It's good to know others have had some of these issues & that there is light at the end of the tunnel. NT has great potential.

Wouldn't you know I forgot something, actually almost always, but on to what I forgot to also mention before you go and make the same mistake I did. I went through the bother of printing out the Online version first... Oh well live and learn. There is a PDF version also available for download off the NinjaTrader Website, much easier to print. (Using the online version is great for the hot links, so they both have there advantages.)

Here is link to the PDF version for download from NinjaTrader.
https://ninjatrader.com/support/helpGuides/nt7/pdf/NinjaTraderVersion7HelpGuide.pdf


Here is link to all help guides on NT7.
NinjaTrader stock, futures and forex charting software and online trading platform. Support.

Have a great rest of your week.

From Bill D. in San Diego

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  #39 (permalink)
 
Alfalfa's Avatar
 Alfalfa 
Knoxville
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: IB, Kinetick
Trading: Stocks
Posts: 11 since Nov 2012
Thanks Given: 15
Thanks Received: 3


Fat Tails View Post
The VWAP that you installed is one of the worst resource hogs ever. I had tested it with CalculateOnBarClose = false on replay x 500, and that indicator alone managed to slow down the replay session from 3 to 40 minutes per day, when used on a single chart. If you use the VWAP indicator in COBC = false, it will definitely cause a freeze of NinjaTrader.

Do that on several charts, and you need a super computer to avoid the freeze.


Before you use free stuff with NinjaTrader you need to test it!

You will find a lot of free stuff for NinjaTrader. But all these free indicators have not gone through any quality control. You need to test them yourself, before you use them! If you put the free stuff on your PC, don't test it and then blame Ninjatrader, because the free stuff does not work, then this is a bit strange.

The anaCurrentDayVWAP - see download section of this forum - uses a recursive formula to calculate VWAP and bands. It should be something like 50 times faster than the VWAP you used. I still would recommend to set it to CalculateOnBarClose = true to avoid to let it recalculate with every incoming tick.

In my opinion all your problems are related to bad indicators and false settings. If you just clean up your workspace and adjust the settings, everything should be fine.

I downloaded & am using several of your custom indicators - very cool. I really like the Multi-period candles - great for helping to visualize & keep in mind how shorter time frame price action is always within longer.

Thanks.

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  #40 (permalink)
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 Big Mike 
Manta, Ecuador
Site Administrator
Developer
Swing Trader
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Custom solution
Broker: IBKR
Trading: Stocks & Futures
Frequency: Every few days
Duration: Weeks
Posts: 50,610 since Jun 2009
Thanks Given: 33,329
Thanks Received: 101,924


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