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I think the distinction you want to really make are
the traders/investors who are aware and so are serious like business
then you have the AWARE gamblers, those who are, as you say, just enjoying a casino with much better payoff odds
but what is really "gambling with your life" is the people who fancy themselves traders or investors
and who take outsized risks and do FOMO and on and on..
most of these are spurred on by lucky gamblers...
in a pool of 100 people who risk too much, and do this, a few will actually succeed..
they will claim its their skill... (and if they dont get serious or start earning money making up some course you pay for, they will blow their accounts and eventually fall back to anonymity)...
these are akin to gambling addicts..
once in a while my wife and i will go to a casino..
i am blessed with a wife who is like me... ie. hate losing, like winning, define losing as less money than you came
i tend to win at the roulette table... but i call it losing slowly..
why? because i put my chips on the crosses.. and with a 5 dollar table and an 8 dollar pay out
i can put down 6 crosses, and 1 on a number... that gives me 25 numbers covered..
but i am not making much... if i make... i am also losing slowly if i lose
but i get way more in comps till they figure out that i am not like other "gamblers"
[been sent a cooler... was accused of stealing a 10k chip (to phase me), even clothing looked at. etc]
but i pointed out a true gambler to my wife..
a woman came down, and was placing small stacks of chips on lots of numbers..
i said to my wife, count the chips... she put down so many that even if she wins one of the numbers
the winning would not cover her losses.. she was playing to FEEL the win, not really have a win
i once met a man who bragged to me in the steam room how he made 50k the night before
he hated me the minute i asked: How much did you take home?
he gave it all back... in his mind, he won.. in my mind, he lost...
i think i will leave it at that..
as that should generate a lot of discussion.
the gambler tends to feel the win, even if they are losing
they also do things like take revenge positions... ie, go in and try to get it back
If you gamble in trading - you have no method/trading model with high probability winning #. You will lose and the unknown is just how fast your account will show balance 0.
If you gamble in the casino you will loss since the house got the edge. Every game you play your odds are lower than the house.
If you want to be a trader, learn the profession, have and edge, method/system that shows high winning probability. Above all have the mental capacity for this kind of work.
In blackjack players have the edge over the casino if they play the right system. That's why casinos are always keeping an eye out for these people and kicking them out.
The point is, if you're going to gamble, whether be in the casino for the stock market, gamble smart. Use the right system whatever you're doing and over the long term you'll have positive results.
I can so relate to this thread. I'm one of the little hopeful guys trying to figure trading out. I've read Al Brooks (I respect him a lot), watched Mack's Youtube's for years and I keep searching for the right method for me. I got laid off 6 months ago so I have had a lot screen time lately. But the unemployed doesn't need to give up money and I have. Not given up the farm, but I have paid some trading "tuition" to learn what does not work. I will probably just have to get a real job again. Been applying. I'm not sure how anyone really learns to daytrade unless already financially free, unless you work at night, but that won't work for me. And you can't cheat on your employer and trade during work hours. Not ethical.
And then there are all the emails I get from Ninjacators promising me they have discovered the next miracle solution for trading and getting rich. Really? I'm watching Market Depth Orderflow today and see that prices knife through "support" and "resistance" at will. But I can be a sucker for these things. True confession. Anyone making money with the Volume Spread Scalper they pushed a few weeks ago? I bought it. Made a few bucks with micro contracts, but only because I scaled in to trades. A bit scared to really trust it. Just one of many ideas I've tried.
I've even been in Al's trading room, which is great education, but most of the time the market is in a "limit order market phase" and he can't call those trades out complete with entry, stop, and exit, and still run the trading room. He does give good advice and things to consider, but no short cuts to profits. Each person must do their own hunting.
My problem is my time is running out. I wanted to prove I could trade by making some money so I wouldn't need to get another job. That is not a good recipe for starting out.
Ok I vented pretty well for my first post. Sorry, but this thread really hit home for me.
Nice post and honesty. Your situation actually reminded me of a time when I was starting to turn the corner on trading and and I asked the group/chat room I belonged to if it made sense to quit my job and take a year off to really see if I could make this thing work. Most in the group who said they tried that basically told me that made things worse. If you aren’t ready it just leads to more pressure, over trading, etc. For some, having more time is obviously a great solution but maybe not for others, especially if you aren’t in a focused environment, with a real edge, with good habits and discipline already established. Are you going to stop trading at 9:46 because you hit your limit down for the day? Or will you sit at the computer all day because you have nothing else to do and are looking to get back to even and make the pain go away. Most of us know how that turns out. Of course if your day job takes place during market hours like most people’s does, that doesn’t work too well either. I guess thats what makes this whole deal so challenging.
When you have an edge (statistical advantage) it is not gambling. That what you need at trading. You do not have it at any game at the casino, not even blackjack as the rules prohibit counting and they added more cards to the block. (no edge)
I appreciate your perspective. Yeah, I stay at the computer and try to make back my losses when I'm behind. Doesn't work often enough. If I haven't done well by 1:30pm CST, it won't probably end well for the day. I may need to research markets I can trade in evening hours or use longer time frames when I get a day job again.
You said" My problem is my time is running out. I wanted to prove I could trade by making some money so I wouldn't need to get another job. That is not a good recipe for starting out. "
Trading is a profession. it can take years, many thousands of screen hours to identify your edge (if you find one)
You will not say what you said if it was to be a lawyer (they make a lot of money) or accountants or a orthopedic doctor. WHY? because they learn the profession for years before they see the first $ comes in. Why do you think trading is different? Why do you think it easy to learn how to do it and make money? how many successful traders do you know personally? (not the ones you talk to on the internet at a chat room), but real day to day financial traders. Ask them how long did it take them to be a trader - a professional that makes living from trading.
I would say it is more for the one that WANTS TO BE a serious trader.
Those 4 parts/14 hours full session should serve as the boot camp/training camp. To be used by the person that really wants to understand what is trading and to start the long process …