NexusFi: Find Your Edge


Home Menu

 





Retail Trading As An Industry


Discussion in Psychology and Money Management

Updated
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one processing with 11 posts (18 thanks)
    2. looks_two deaddog with 8 posts (25 thanks)
    3. looks_3 SMCJB with 5 posts (33 thanks)
    4. looks_4 DowDaddy with 5 posts (10 thanks)
      Best Posters
    1. looks_one wldman with 13 thanks per post
    2. looks_two GlobexTrader with 8.7 thanks per post
    3. looks_3 SMCJB with 6.6 thanks per post
    4. looks_4 deaddog with 3.1 thanks per post
    1. trending_up 5,415 views
    2. thumb_up 297 thanks given
    3. group 327 followers
    1. forum 76 posts
    2. attach_file 1 attachments




 
Search this Thread

Retail Trading As An Industry

  #21 (permalink)
 
DowDaddy's Avatar
 DowDaddy 
Las Vegas
 
Experience: Master
Platform: Ninja
Broker: Ninja Trader Brokerage
Trading: Dow Futures
Posts: 393 since Oct 2021
Thanks Given: 748
Thanks Received: 391


processing View Post
And if you lose all your chips, you can't bet.

If you don't bet, you can't win.




Larry Hite haha one of the best traders to ever do it his interview in market wizards changed my entire outlook on trading

If you don't bet, you can't win.

Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
Thanked by:

Can you help answer these questions
from other members on NexusFi?
About a successful futures trader who didnt know anythin …
Psychology and Money Management
REcommedations for programming help
Sierra Chart
Trade idea based off three indicators.
Traders Hideout
Pivot Indicator like the old SwingTemp by Big Mike
NinjaTrader
Better Renko Gaps
The Elite Circle
 
  #22 (permalink)
 
deaddog's Avatar
 deaddog 
Prince George BC Canada
Legendary Market Wizard
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: National Bank Direct
Broker: NBD/BMO/Questrade
Trading: Stocks
Frequency: Every few days
Duration: Weeks
Posts: 1,307 since May 2013
Thanks Given: 185
Thanks Received: 4,076


ES Jedi View Post
Larry Hite haha one of the best traders to ever do it his interview in market wizards changed my entire outlook on trading

If you don't bet, you can't win.

You should give the whole quote

"I have two basic rules about winning in trading as well as in life: 1. If you don't bet, you can't win.
2. If you lose all your chips, you can't bet."

"The days when I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days" RW Hubbard
Reply With Quote
  #23 (permalink)
 
DowDaddy's Avatar
 DowDaddy 
Las Vegas
 
Experience: Master
Platform: Ninja
Broker: Ninja Trader Brokerage
Trading: Dow Futures
Posts: 393 since Oct 2021
Thanks Given: 748
Thanks Received: 391



deaddog View Post
You should give the whole quote



"I have two basic rules about winning in trading as well as in life: 1. If you don't bet, you can't win.

2. If you lose all your chips, you can't bet."

I agree I have it above my trading station but just felt like it's too long for a signature block Lol and hesitation is my biggest trading demon

If you don't bet, you can't win.

Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #24 (permalink)
DJC Trader
Southampton
 
Posts: 1 since Aug 2020
Thanks Given: 0
Thanks Received: 1

Agree with this sentiment. And a rabbit hole I've been down myself.

If anyone knows of any strategies that actually work, let me know! I think mindset, money management etc are all part and parcel of it, but at the heart you need a method that is statistically proven (over a very large set of data) to have profitability.

Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #25 (permalink)
 kevinkdog   is a Vendor
 
Posts: 3,666 since Jul 2012
Thanks Given: 1,892
Thanks Received: 7,360


DJC Trader View Post
Agree with this sentiment. And a rabbit hole I've been down myself.

If anyone knows of any strategies that actually work, let me know! I think mindset, money management etc are all part and parcel of it, but at the heart you need a method that is statistically proven (over a very large set of data) to have profitability.

I always tell people this. To be a successful trader, you need:
1) strategies that work
2) the discipline to trade them properly

Most people focus on #2 - things like mindset, risk management, emotional control, diversification, etc. They are all important, but without #1 combined with #2, you will eventually fail.

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
  #26 (permalink)
 OneEye 
The Netherlands
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: proprietary
Trading: ES
Posts: 41 since Dec 2017
Thanks Given: 151
Thanks Received: 58


processing View Post
It feels like it is implying "the course strategies all work" and "if you don't profit consistently" and "if you don't make money" or "[insert another phrase here]" it is always due to the trader's mindset. "It is the trader's fault." Meaning it is never the broker's fault. Or the fact that some strategies aren't meant to work in all markets.

It almost feels as though there is a disclaimer that trading teachers say: "If you take my course and you don't succeed, it's not my fault, just try harder, because it's your mindset that is the issue."


"the course strategies all work".

No, this is an illusion. You can't get a winning strategy on a course for the simple reason that everyone would be trading that same strategy within 1 week and the market inefficiency has gone.

I know of only 1 strategy that is 95% sure to be profitable: buy the index and hold it for 10+ years.

On short term, efficient markets have a lot of noise / randomness: nobody knows a more correct price than the current price, for if they did, they would trade the market and bring it to that price.

So, most traders should expect that about 50% of their trades are wrong.

And here is where the mindset comes in: if you are unwilling to admit that half the time your bet is wrong, you bet size will be too large and you will stick to losing positions that are against the market. And be forced out or chicken out of your position at the worst possible time.

My 2 cents, I am interested in the thoughts of Mr. wldman

Reply With Quote
  #27 (permalink)
 
Bookworm's Avatar
 Bookworm 
Long Island, NY
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TOS
Broker: TD Ameritrade
Trading: Equities, index options and futures/futures options
Posts: 190 since Apr 2010
Thanks Given: 66
Thanks Received: 198

To become profitable as a trader you need two things. Each of which is essential for success. First you need a method that has a positive expectancy. Then that method needs to be consistently applied to the market. Finding that edge often requires an immense amount of work studying and back testing. The edge you have today may be gone next year and require finding a new one. I mostly trade options and over the years I've seen various strategies such as iron condors, broken wing butterflies and time spreads fall in and out of favor as market behavior changes. The consistency is where the psychology comes into play. Behavior that is useful in regular life can become counterproductive in markets when for example fear and greed cause abandonment of sound decision making. In what is basically a zero sum environment the vast majority of participants will end up losing money to a small group of successful players and it is very difficult to overcome that.

Reply With Quote
  #28 (permalink)
 
wldman's Avatar
 wldman 
Chicago Illinois USA
Legendary Market Wizard
 
Experience: Advanced
Broker: IB, ToS
Trading: /ES, US Equities/Options
Frequency: Several times daily
Duration: Hours
Posts: 3,534 since Aug 2011
Thanks Given: 2,069
Thanks Received: 9,556

Already quite a bit to overcome in this thread IMO. I'm not sure I can give it (the topic) the attention that it deserves...but I will try.

Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
  #29 (permalink)
 
AllSeeker's Avatar
 AllSeeker 
Mumbai, India
Legendary Pratik_4Clover
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: TradingView & ZerodhaKite
Trading: NIFTY, BANKNIFTY
Frequency: Daily
Duration: Minutes
Posts: 1,426 since Jan 2019
Thanks Given: 5,249
Thanks Received: 5,014

Just my 2c

I think "you" as in trader becomes a lot more important when you don't have statistically proven edge. Because you are basically trading on your own judgement at that time, so yeah..

But that doesn't mean when you have one such an edge you become any less important, at the end of the day it's you who needs to trust it and put money on line.

See the issue? It's hard to put it in words which is which.


Most traders are in between, both in terms of finding edge and dealing with their own psychology. It's usually a 2 fold problem. Someone here has mentioned that being involved with sports helps, for sure, because sports is similar feild. Lot of numbers, strategies, lot of combinations and permutations but execution is also key. One can't really live without other.

So yeah, what you have read and been told is not false, it's just that scammers make clever use of it to absolve themselves of all responsibility.

Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
  #30 (permalink)
 Deetee 
Amsterdam, The Netherlands
Market Wizard
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader / IB /Rithmic
Broker: EdgeClear / InteractiveBrokers / Rithmic
Trading: DAX / (M)NQ / (M)ES
Frequency: Daily
Duration: Hours
Posts: 631 since Jul 2019
Thanks Given: 2,825
Thanks Received: 788



DJC Trader View Post
Agree with this sentiment. And a rabbit hole I've been down myself.

If anyone knows of any strategies that actually work, let me know! I think mindset, money management etc are all part and parcel of it, but at the heart you need a method that is statistically proven (over a very large set of data) to have profitability.

I would suggest to check this one out:



With special thanks to @JonnyBoy for the extended description of setups.

As with (IMO) any strategy, you'll need to put time into it, lots of time

Attached Images
 
Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
Thanked by:




Last Updated on March 18, 2024


© 2024 NexusFi™, s.a., All Rights Reserved.
Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama City, Panama, Ph: +507 833-9432 (Panama and Intl), +1 888-312-3001 (USA and Canada)
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice. There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
About Us - Contact Us - Site Rules, Acceptable Use, and Terms and Conditions - Privacy Policy - Downloads - Top
no new posts