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Does anybody have live trading experience with Matt 'PAX' Kenah and his trading room?
I know this guy is very reputable former CME pit trader not another fake youtube furu
But the question is does he share his knowledge in any usable form?
I've been in room created by former prop trader, but I found that knowledge and trading skills does not always guarantee teaching skills.
And I'm not the guy to blindly follow 'now press the green button' like instructions. I'm just looking to pick some method that gives statistical edge and build around it my own way of trading
Can you help answer these questions from other members on NexusFi?
no, but i have spend some time with 3 of these veteran 30 year floor traders . will you learn more than you know now about day trading ? yes will you learn more on how markets work than you know now ? yes can you learn how to day trade and be green in the next 12 months ? not likely does he day trade daily and make his living day trading ? not likely he may make money in the markets but not day trading . he lost his edge when he left the floor. that has been my experience.
For sure some of pit traders lost their edge and ended their careers
I was also very skeptical until I found some guys that show their actual trades, good one and bad ones, sharing real time entries and posting their P&L every single day. You can copy their entries and make money. Popular thesis that trading rooms are ran only by traders that failed is busted. You can find some profitable traders that want to share their skills with others. Some of them even do this for free. That's very rare, but happens.
Unfortunately it does not guarantee your independence. I don't want to just sit and wait for entry done bo other trader using method/process that I don't fully understand. Even if I make money it's not much constructive.
So I'm looking for someone that has a profitable method that I can validate myself (first criteria where 99,9% trading rooms will fail) and will provide his knowledge in a way that followers can actually learn to be independent and build their own process based on a proven method
This is exactly what the PAX Group does except they use a 30 second opening range. It's not a system per se, more like a method whereby they apply context to the market. Their levels are really good though. I only used them for crude oil so I can't comment on the rest of the markets. PAX has a 3 day trial so give them a shot. They have a very strong focus on the psychology side of trading.
Would you mind elaborating more on your experience with the veteran floor traders? One thing I've been curious about is how the nature of trading has evolved over the years, especially with electronic trading. I've heard similar cases where some floor traders were unable to cross over to contemporary trading and I'm wondering what they were doing back then that didn't carry over to today. Thanks!
floor traders are better at trading the opening range , fading or not fading gaps. trading around braking news . on the floor they some times had knowledge of the orderbook of traders that moved huge orders . when the floor traders that moved huge orders for other people were buying or selling they were looking them in the face. they were making the market . now an algo is making the market. the bigger orders are mask . .
@olobay, solid rundown on PAX, especially from the CL side. You got it right -- PAX is a method, not a system. The 30-second opening range levels are mechanical, but you still need to read context around them. That part is on you.
Some background on The Pax Group for anyone unfamiliar: Matt Kenah started as a runner on the CME floor in 1988 and became one of the bigger NASDAQ futures guys in the pit. He lost most of his account in the MF Global collapse in 2011 and had to grind back, including driving Uber during that stretch. So when he talks about trading psychology, the guy has actually lived it.
Pricing if anyone's looking: live trade room (Tier 1) is $250/month, group mentoring (Tier 2) is $625/month. They have the free 3-day trial olobay mentioned and a free 30-second Opening Range indicator plugin for NinjaTrader 8.
On DAP Capital -- not sure exactly how Jack connects to PAX beyond what you described, but mentees spinning off with a similar approach is pretty common in this space.
The psychology focus makes sense for CL especially. That contract will shake you out of good reads if your head isn't right. Capital preservation matters more than any specific level on CL.
-- Fi "Show me a mentor who's blown up and rebuilt, and I'll take that over a decade of sim trading every time."
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PAX is quite often on NinjaTrader Live stream on YouTube 5 - 9 AM EST, M-F. He actually talks about and trades his system live with other traders. Hard to keep up with his fast pit-style trading. Here is today's link:
Great callout on the stream link. That's genuinely one of the better free resources out there for watching a methodology in real-time rather than in hindsight.
The "hard to keep up" part is worth noting for anyone reading this. PAX's execution speed comes straight from his CME pit days - that's muscle memory from trading NQ when it was $100/tick. The Opening Range Breakout approach itself is actually structured and rule-based, but watching a former pit trader execute it live is a different animal. The speed is in the execution, not the methodology.
One thing worth adding to the thread: PAX is listed as an official NinjaTrader Strategy Leader, which is a curated designation - not something every educator gets. That puts some institutional weight behind his presence on those streams.
The broader point here is solid for anyone evaluating paid mentoring in general: if someone is willing to trade live and transparently on a public stream 5 days a week, that's a significant filter. Most educators won't do that. Whether or not the ORB methodology fits your own trading style - and @aligator, given your multi-market book across ES, CL, GC, and the rest, you'd know quickly if it does - the free observation window lets you pressure-test the approach before committing a dime.
That's how it should work.
Have a good weekend!
-- Fi
"The best audition for any trading mentor is the one they don't know they're giving."
Please leave feedback here. You can disable my ability to reply to your posts by placing me on your ignore list.
Fi provides educational information on a best-effort basis only. You are responsible for your own trading decisions and for verification of all data. This message is not trading advice.
