NexusFi: Find Your Edge


Home Menu

 





Selling Options on Futures?


Discussion in Options

Updated
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one ron99 with 2,221 posts (4,489 thanks)
    2. looks_two SMCJB with 346 posts (733 thanks)
    3. looks_3 kevinkdog with 341 posts (400 thanks)
    4. looks_4 myrrdin with 288 posts (408 thanks)
      Best Posters
    1. looks_one SMCJB with 2.1 thanks per post
    2. looks_two ron99 with 2 thanks per post
    3. looks_3 myrrdin with 1.4 thanks per post
    4. looks_4 kevinkdog with 1.2 thanks per post
    1. trending_up 2,006,768 views
    2. thumb_up 9,259 thanks given
    3. group 458 followers
    1. forum 7,370 posts
    2. attach_file 794 attachments




 
Search this Thread

Selling Options on Futures?

  #3951 (permalink)
 datahogg 
Knoxville Tennessee USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TOS
Trading: ES, NQ, CL, /6E futures options.
Posts: 346 since Oct 2012
Thanks Given: 135
Thanks Received: 154


rsm005 View Post
Well, here's the results of my first trade aaannndddd it didn't go well. Total premium collected $960 on CL. Trade was 27% out of the money and t turned on me inside of 30mins on Friday and the first 45mins on Monday morning. Oil shot up a whopping 13% and my mental stop was hit. I executed my trade but the bid/ask was not in my favor and viola...I got creamed. With the ratio spread I contained the damage but in the end I ended up down almost $3k.

The experience left me a little

and

It really sucks that this is how I have to start the experience but I did learn a lot and I'm taking that information with me to the next trade.

1. The position was too large relative to my account size. My gut told me but I ignored it, not again.
2. I need to sell further out of the money. A .04 delta was just not enough. After reading this thread a few times the number should be closer to .02 or .01. copied and pasted datahogg's post on the same thread to get an idea of just how far out. You still probably haven't noticed the rally . Congratulations man...I need to be more in tune with you and ron99's methods.
3. I need to diversify soon. My original goal was to trade one commodity at a time until I understood the fundamentals well and then add others. Although that sounded good it lends itself to big issues when a single trade goes against me. This is especially true as I'm making much smaller trades.
4. Only aim to make 3%-5% per trade. On this particular trade I tried to go with 10% and that just ended up burning me. See point 1.
5. Get a broker that won't nail me on margins. One of the main reasons I couldn't sell a strangle on my original position, which would have mitigated my losses even more, was because OX was adding so much additional margin to do it. This didn't leave me with the residual 3x cash. I've since opened an account with DeCarley and will see how that goes. I could have simply gone with a smaller trade but didn't...and that again goes back to point 1.
6. Losing hurts..not getting back in the game hurts more. I can see how easy it is to just quit and go back to my career and life but then I would learn anything and I know I can learn and be successful at this.

I'm hoping to get some feedback from the more seasoned people here when I structure my next trade. Thanks all.

/A/

"I sold 12 March15 calls at $58 for a $900 premium."

If I read correctly you sold 12 March 58 calls which will expire 03/18/15 .
What was the premium sold for each call? Because 58 x 12 = $696 not $900 .
Just wanted to look back at your trade. Thanks.

Reply With Quote

Can you help answer these questions
from other members on NexusFi?
ZombieSqueeze
Platforms and Indicators
What broker to use for trading palladium futures
Commodities
Cheap historycal L1 data for stocks
Stocks and ETFs
use extra computer for optimisation
NinjaTrader
Better Renko Gaps
The Elite Circle
 
  #3952 (permalink)
 ron99 
Cleveland, OH
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Trading: Options on Futures
Posts: 3,081 since Jul 2011
Thanks Given: 980
Thanks Received: 5,785


datahogg View Post
"I sold 12 March15 calls at $58 for a $900 premium."

If I read correctly you sold 12 March 58 calls which will expire 03/18/15 .
What was the premium sold for each call? Because 58 x 12 = $696 not $900 .
Just wanted to look back at your trade. Thanks.

His strike is 58. Divide $900 by 12 to get his dollars per option.

Mar calls do not expire 3/18/15.

Started this thread Reply With Quote
  #3953 (permalink)
 ron99 
Cleveland, OH
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Trading: Options on Futures
Posts: 3,081 since Jul 2011
Thanks Given: 980
Thanks Received: 5,785


ICE is doing the following webinar,

Thursday, February 5, 2015 4:15 pm
Eastern Standard Time (New York)

Using Options to Trade the ICE Sugar and Coffee Markets.

Please join ICE and Zaner Group as they present Paul Forchione, veteran options strategist and author of Trading Options Visually: What You Must Know to Trade Options on Futures, discussing ways to analyze and select appropriate trading strategies using ICE Sugar (SB) and Coffee (KC) options.

Among the topics covered in this webinar are:
•How to match strategic directional and implied volatility strategies for current market conditions
•Ways to employ practical techniques to obtain a trading advantage when entering markets
•Methods to construct well-crafted trading plans

https://icewebinar.webex.com/mw0401lsp11/mywebex/default.do?nomenu=true&siteurl=icewebinar&service=6&rnd=0.39113140595993434&main_url=https%3A%2F%2Ficewebinar.webex.com%2Fec0701lsp11%2Feventcenter%2Fevent%2FeventAction.do%3FtheAction%3Ddetail%26confViewID%3D1751251070%26%26EMK%3D4832534b00000002ab52432655e1cd6232554ac4ec6d8a45018de1be4158d5d9835015f50c0b208f%26%26%26siteurl%3Dicewebinar

I have no idea if this will be worthwhile or not. Just thought I would let you know about it.

Started this thread Reply With Quote
  #3954 (permalink)
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 Big Mike 
Manta, Ecuador
Site Administrator
Developer
Swing Trader
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Custom solution
Broker: IBKR
Trading: Stocks & Futures
Frequency: Every few days
Duration: Weeks
Posts: 50,469 since Jun 2009
Thanks Given: 33,249
Thanks Received: 101,669

The futures.io (formerly BMT) webinar at the same time on neural networks will be more fun

Sent from my phone



Join the free Markets Chat beta: one platform, all the trade rooms!

We're here to help: just ask the community or contact our Help Desk

Quick Links: Change your Username or Register as a Vendor
Searching for trading reviews? Review this list
Lifetime Elite Membership: Sign-up for only $149 USD
Exclusive money saving offers from our Site Sponsors: Browse Offers
Report problems with the site: Using the NexusFi changelog thread
Follow me on Twitter Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
  #3955 (permalink)
 datahogg 
Knoxville Tennessee USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TOS
Trading: ES, NQ, CL, /6E futures options.
Posts: 346 since Oct 2012
Thanks Given: 135
Thanks Received: 154


ron99 View Post
His strike is 58. Divide $900 by 12 to get his dollars per option.

Mar calls do not expire 3/18/15.

At any rate the margin for these calls now is astronomical.

Reply With Quote
  #3956 (permalink)
 datahogg 
Knoxville Tennessee USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TOS
Trading: ES, NQ, CL, /6E futures options.
Posts: 346 since Oct 2012
Thanks Given: 135
Thanks Received: 154


ron99 View Post
His strike is 58. Divide $900 by 12 to get his dollars per option.

Mar calls do not expire 3/18/15.

OK when do they expire??

Reply With Quote
  #3957 (permalink)
 ron99 
Cleveland, OH
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Trading: Options on Futures
Posts: 3,081 since Jul 2011
Thanks Given: 980
Thanks Received: 5,785


datahogg View Post
OK when do they expire??

2/17/15

Started this thread Reply With Quote
  #3958 (permalink)
psears
Richmond, VA/USA
 
Posts: 35 since Nov 2012
Thanks Given: 3
Thanks Received: 11

Hi all,

This is my first post since the total destruction of my trading account courtesy of naked Gold puts explosion of a couple of years back :-(
I have been reading this threat from the start, and am currently at post 86. Good stuff-can't believe it's still going!

I'm thinking about getting back into option selling (with a few changes from the last time :-) and was thinking about just concentrating on the grains (specifically corn) to start with. My long-term goal is to learn one market at a time and become good at that, then slowly adding more markets until I can talk about them like Ron99 and the rest of you players do.

I want to start reading fundamental reports and get knowledgable about what is causing the longer-term trends. I know The Hightower Report has been mentioned here, although I know it talks about more than just grains. Is it worth the money? How about the USDA reports like WASDE? Good or a waste of time (40 pages!)? Any other reports y'all can think of that might help me become knowledagble in the corn/grains?

Currently reading Cordier's book, listening to a book on the grains business while driving, and reading your posts. I know this can be done for the long-term, since you all can't be just lucky over so many years :-) so I am in this for the long haul (retirement), and ready to study...

Thoughts?

Reply With Quote
  #3959 (permalink)
 ron99 
Cleveland, OH
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Trading: Options on Futures
Posts: 3,081 since Jul 2011
Thanks Given: 980
Thanks Received: 5,785


psears View Post
Hi all,

This is my first post since the total destruction of my trading account courtesy of naked Gold puts explosion of a couple of years back :-(
I have been reading this threat from the start, and am currently at post 86. Good stuff-can't believe it's still going!

I'm thinking about getting back into option selling (with a few changes from the last time :-) and was thinking about just concentrating on the grains (specifically corn) to start with. My long-term goal is to learn one market at a time and become good at that, then slowly adding more markets until I can talk about them like Ron99 and the rest of you players do.

I want to start reading fundamental reports and get knowledgable about what is causing the longer-term trends. I know The Hightower Report has been mentioned here, although I know it talks about more than just grains. Is it worth the money? How about the USDA reports like WASDE? Good or a waste of time (40 pages!)? Any other reports y'all can think of that might help me become knowledagble in the corn/grains?

Currently reading Cordier's book, listening to a book on the grains business while driving, and reading your posts. I know this can be done for the long-term, since you all can't be just lucky over so many years :-) so I am in this for the long haul (retirement), and ready to study...

Thoughts?

You can get Hightower, Wyckoff, Gramza and Dow Jones opinion/news for free from OX. Just open an account and I don't think you even have to put any money in it. My current OX account has 11 cents in it.

USDA data is good. USDA forecasts are poor.

If you are doing grains the main thing you will need to watch is weather across the globe. That makes trading grains volatile because weather is unpredictable.

One seasonal in grains I play is price dropping in Sep and rising in Oct.

PS I got nailed on that Sep 2011 Gold drop too. It was so unpredictable.

Started this thread Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #3960 (permalink)
 myrrdin 
Linz Austria
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TWS
Broker: Interactive Brokers
Trading: Commodities
Posts: 1,938 since Nov 2014
Thanks Given: 3,688
Thanks Received: 2,651



psears View Post
Hi all,

This is my first post since the total destruction of my trading account courtesy of naked Gold puts explosion of a couple of years back :-(
I have been reading this threat from the start, and am currently at post 86. Good stuff-can't believe it's still going!

I'm thinking about getting back into option selling (with a few changes from the last time :-) and was thinking about just concentrating on the grains (specifically corn) to start with. My long-term goal is to learn one market at a time and become good at that, then slowly adding more markets until I can talk about them like Ron99 and the rest of you players do.

I want to start reading fundamental reports and get knowledgable about what is causing the longer-term trends. I know The Hightower Report has been mentioned here, although I know it talks about more than just grains. Is it worth the money? How about the USDA reports like WASDE? Good or a waste of time (40 pages!)? Any other reports y'all can think of that might help me become knowledagble in the corn/grains?

Currently reading Cordier's book, listening to a book on the grains business while driving, and reading your posts. I know this can be done for the long-term, since you all can't be just lucky over so many years :-) so I am in this for the long haul (retirement), and ready to study...

Thoughts?


Major part of my option selling program currently is grains & beans. But in my opinion it is important to trade a large variety of commodities to avoid clump risk.

Hightower is free of charge also with deCarley Trading and RJO. It is certainly worth reading.

I also like the weekly report of Arlan Suderman (Water Street Solutions): "MarketSense Weekly". It covers Supply & Demand, weather short-term and long-term etc. You will find it via google.

My favourite regarding grains & beans is the internal reporting of RJO for their customers.

The most important thing about the USDA reports is the reaction of the markets to these reports. I only read the abstract of Hightower.

I wish you a successful re-start of your option selling activities.

Best regards from Austria, Myrrdin

Reply With Quote




Last Updated on July 28, 2023


© 2024 NexusFi™, s.a., All Rights Reserved.
Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama City, Panama, Ph: +507 833-9432 (Panama and Intl), +1 888-312-3001 (USA and Canada)
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice. There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
About Us - Contact Us - Site Rules, Acceptable Use, and Terms and Conditions - Privacy Policy - Downloads - Top
no new posts