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I feel very similarly to OP (although Ive started trading much more recently)
There is so much conflicting information on the internet. Even if you look into similar philosophies of trading, there are several different schools of thought each with their own unique spin. Theres no doubt in my mind that some of them, maybe even conflicting ones, can be profitable, but Im also certain that there are certain plans/ways of looking at the market that will never lead to consistent profits no matter how rigorously theyre practice or mastered.
The problem with a lot of these is that theres no way to test them because they are all discretionary
From a beginners perspective its all so noisy its hard to separate the wheat from the chaff (and if I was able to I wouldnt need the help in the first place)
Im contemplating looking for a mentor directly that I can verify, at least that way theres no doubt that the system has the potential to lead to profitability and I wont be wasting my time practicing and learning.
...you can test discretionary setups/methods/systems. It's probably one of the most worthwhile things a beginner can do. But it takes time...lots of time. And there will be dead-ends, and then the lost feeling will come back, but then there will be successes. Small ones probably. But hopefully they accumulate.
It's only my opinion, but I would never pay for a mentor. I've never heard from anyone that has found success doing that. The success stories may exist, but pay-mentor disaster stories are very common. .
You can find lots of experienced dudes on FIO that are willing to help you through some stuff. Some may even help you find ways to test some discretionary stuff. Good luck!
I agree on paying for mentors, it's not something I would ever do either. I used to mentor for some classes last year and I felt guilty accepting any form of payment - I wanted to help those as a way to pay back those that have helped me - and I'd assume trading is very similar (maybe even more so due to it's emotionally challenging nature)
I would recommend absorbing yourself into the book by David Aronson called Evidence Based Technical Analysis. He basically confirms what I have been thinking for years; Technical Analysis is bunk unless its structure for testing is non subjective and mathematical. For example in the first few chapters, he totally debunks the head and shoulders pattern that we hear so much about these days. He completely strips any validity that some people believe this chart "pattern" has.
His book is not for the feint of heart. You need to understand basic math and statistics, but he walks you through it step by step. I highly recommended this book.
It is very amusing to watch people discuss trading patterns that David has proven to be useless junk, backed up by his evidence based testing and analysis. If you were wondering about the "upside down bat hanging in a cave with its teeth falling out" chart pattern being profitable, you'll soon come to realise it all means nothing.
You can get to his book via this website that has much more information than I can possibly cover here.
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- Trade what you see. Invest in what you believe -
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It is also available on Kindle Unlimited for "free" I think.
I just read a few pages, but as long as the title is understood, that is pretty much the main thing.
And the technical discussions here are pretty lame.
Indicators are totally misunderstood. It would be interesting to read an "academic" history of technical analysis. It's like a would be trader/technician asked an academic to develop something for the greedy and lazy.
Nice. I would continue reading it. I have re-read it numerous times and always find it a great read. I found the hardcopy much easier to navigate than the electronic version.
The indicator side of things I agree with. The majority of them are a self fulfilling prophecy, in that we believe they work because we believe they work! There will never be a shortage of new traders harvesting as many indicators as they can believing they can find an edge that nobody else has found. It takes a while until you realise that you need to remove subjectivity from your analysis. If you can do this, then an edge can be found.
For example, I have built myself a trading system/method that uses zero technical analysis to generate its signals. I am not totally indicator free in that I use VWAP, which yes, it is a moving average ala technical indicator, but its history of institutional execution benchmarking against it makes it the only moving average of worth. My opinion of course, but I have numerous white papers courtesy of my ex-institutional buddy how VWAP is used and why. Very powerful stuff that if used properly can be enabled to find an edge.
I do have trendlines on my chart for guidance, but my signals are generated only from the Level I, Level II and price action using a bespoke data series. That is it. No technical indicator based decisions at all.
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- Trade what you see. Invest in what you believe -
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Hi,
Sorry for not posting sooner, but I trade for a living and don't have time to sit in chat rooms all day dispensing advice.
But here goes again until my next appearance:
How not to learn how to trade:
1- going into chat rooms and hope that some multi-millionaire is going to teach you all he or she knows about trading.
2- buying a book
3 - trying out trading ideas on your own.
4 - Buying some $99 per month online web course where the guru tells you how successful he or she is. ASK THEM HOW GOOD THEIR CLIENTS ARE. TALK TO THE CLIENTS. MORE THAN ONE.
There are lots of great replies here and as a beginner trader I am also in a similar situation where consistency is a big issue. Above all I think we have to be clear of our entry strategy and the fact that it has some sort of a profitable edge. If our system fails nothing is going to help in the first place. Once we sorted out it, with small yet inconsistent wins, we maybe able to build our confidence issues and all other psychological issues that come after. Any views on this?
It takes thousands of hours of practice to become a master of a craft. Trading is a technical skill, and like any other technical skills it requires practice/repetition. Repetition makes perfect.
For example a person who wants to become a very good dentist, he will learn the theory first, then will spend years practicing on fake teeth/mouths to master his craft before attempting to work on a human being.
Would you go to a dentist that only read a couple of books, watched a couple of courses and barely practiced?
To me it was more than 6 years of sweat, blood, tears and losses til I finally stopped losing money, but mostly because I Was my own mentor, so I had to discover all by myself. I believe it could have been less if I had had a mentor to point me in the right direction, I wasted a lot of time with classical TA trying to come up with indicator based systems (which at the time I thought it was the correct way for trading = mechanical trading). I was ready to give up when I discovered VSA (volume spread analysis), as I posted in another thread, this was a game changer for me and it was like scales came off my eyes and I could finally read a chart properly. VSA is a modern adaptation of the Wyckoff method. Richard Wyckoff was a legendary trader and considered the "father of tape reading". His trading principles work today as they worked 100 years ago or so.
After discovering this, even then it took at least three years of deep study and practice of the method to reach a specialist level and the principles become second nature. Just donīt give up because success could be just around the corner, a lot of people give up when they are almost achieving what they wanted, that is what separates successful people from the rest.
The majority of the traders lose because the majority of people is too lazy to sit down and study and practice, even if they have the right knowledge. Those people just wanna a system that will flash green for them to buy, and red to sell. System/course sellers thrive on this, because they sell the illusion that is very easy to make money without putting the effort.