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What programs have you bought? Confess

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What programs have you bought? Confess

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  #21 (permalink)
Posts: 1,173 since Nov 2009

David_R View Post
Yes, OFA (orderflow analytics)

what was so bad about OFA program?

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  #22 (permalink)
Posts: 1,173 since Nov 2009

Total Expense, no idea.. first time I am adding it up I guess...

- NinjaTrader ($1500)
- Multicharts ($3000 - two licenses, one dev and one prod)
- RightEdge 2010 ($700)
- ATrader ($300)
- Hoadley Tols (~$200, very useful)
- PairTradeFinder (~$700, somewhat useful)

- Jurik (TS and NT7) ($800,Useful)
- EminiWatch ($500,Useful)
- Currensys ($1000, Useful)
- EminiShark ($1000, Useful)
- EOTPro ($1000, waste of time)

- Tape Reading Room ($3000, somewhat useful)
- Fulcrum Trader ($1000, somewhat useful)
- Field of Vision ($750, useful)

- overall, less than $1000... most I can find in

On-going Subs
- IQFeed ~$200
- GRI ~$200

Misc Stuff (forums, etc)
- $1000 overall, less actually.

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  #23 (permalink)
David_R's Avatar
San Jose, Ca
Legendary Market Wizard
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: Something moving
Posts: 1,582 since Nov 2009
Thanks Given: 2,335
Thanks Received: 2,524

I think it all falls into the category of education, but they main thing with all these programs is that we (I) buy them think they are what will make me a successful trader. I have no complaints about any of the programs I bought. The only one I think was not worth is was the nextbartrading course. His stuff is just taken from VSA. His videos on youtube are what sold me. I really wanted to know how the hell he did it. Well, its really is the person and not the method.

I actually forgot a couple things I spent money on. The one that really had value for me was the Gary Dayton Chart reading course. No software or DVDs. Just a course on how to read a chart with Wyckoff principles.


rkhanen View Post
David. What are your thoughts an all these programs, DVD's etc. Worth anything?

This is a very interesting thread indeed. I still have not come around to pile money into expensive programmes, but oh buy I have felt the urge...especially during draw downs.

I am mostly interested in Trade Guider, but have heard on Elite Traders that the signals are bogus (they magically show up after the fact or change). This is an uncomfirmed rumor though from my side.

I have mostly spend money on newsletters (they are quite cheap) and they are not worth the money. So far the best deals have been The Kirk Report (tons of resources) and this site (tons & tons of resources).

I subscribed to All About Trends for a while an actually did a review of their performance on my site (you can watch it if you magically happen to understand danish). They have af win ratio of 76% on long trades (on 205 trades), but have huge draw downs. That is not for me.

I also subscribed to Morpheus Trading which have lousy performance. If anyone is interested I can post performance charts on the services in this thread.

Also subscribed to TheUptrend (Canada based) which was bogus. He changed signals after the fact...

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  #24 (permalink)
desert CA
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, various
Broker: various, TDA
Trading: NQ,ES
Posts: 2,124 since Jul 2011
Thanks Given: 2,396
Thanks Received: 1,746

More of an MT4 system sucker before I came here.

The following were a waste of time:

Dynamic Trader v4 $2k (old scam. NT7 can do all it can do easy with free indicators)
Forex Godfather $97(refunded)
LMT Forex Formula $97
Forex Crescendo $97 (refunded)
Top Dog Trading courses, Barry Burns $400+
Forex Rebellion $97
Timothy Sykes Penny Stock Millionaire $2k (refunded, after much hassle) $200 (hiding/changing losers, inserting after-the-fact winners in public performance "records") $97 $500, 1 yr membership. (the same 7 people keep posting , rarely... only like 1 or 2 of the winning
surefire trading contest winners didn't have a massive drawdown %, most articles from other vendors' free stuff. webinars by staff only a few hours long, and not enough covered or taught to be consistent.)
Quantified Stock Market Trading Strategies & Systems - "powerratings" $99 x 3 months (cancelled, ratings not 80%, more like 50% i.e. throw a dart blindfolded , kept getting ads for "the machine", $3k to use or something)
"traders secret code" Day Trading System $97
Home - Jon Markman's Trader's Advantage by Jon Markman $99 x 2 months (cancelled. very bad losers, single option calls and puts. I don't even think Markman himself chose those trades. Some kind of crap shop hired to make the signal newsletter/website; kept fudging or hiding losers in public performance "records". After this, leery of CNBC, FOX "celebrities"' services i.e. Maria Bartolomo, Larry Levin etc. )
Various trading books, some used/old $200

Somewhat useful: $67
Lindencourt FX $150
Trade What you See, by Pensavento, Jouflas $40

Useful: $197 +$60 (bonus videos)
Reading Price Charts Bar by Bar , Al Brooks $60
Brooks trading room $99x2months ( stopped, got all the archive videos for those months. enough to rewatch his
reasoning as Al Brooks doesn't call out trades anyways, room mainly for education)

Just started: $400 (I like the "better" indicators suite so far. What's so bad about it?)
Ninjatrader 7, 3months start $288
The Complete Guide to Option Selling by Cordier, Gross $25

Never went to any paid seminars or other trading rooms except Brooks for 2 months. CJBooths 6E trading room I'm
glad I stumbled upon. Bobbyaicm saying it's the best room he's been in. And others mention his room better than most paid rooms out there.

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  #25 (permalink)
David_R's Avatar
San Jose, Ca
Legendary Market Wizard
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: Something moving
Posts: 1,582 since Nov 2009
Thanks Given: 2,335
Thanks Received: 2,524

sysot1t View Post
what was so bad about OFA program?

there is nothing wrong with the OFA program. As a matter of fact it is probably very good. I think it all comes down to the person or the user though. I do think they charge too much just like most vendors. Selling the dream calls for a big price tag and that's what they bank on.

Key to successful trading:

1. get your mind right 90%

2. method 10%

the 90/10 may be a bit out of balance, but I firmly believe that having the mind in order will make any method better. I struggle every day with the mental aspects of trading.


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  #26 (permalink)
furytrader's Avatar
Lake Forest, IL USA
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: MultiCharts + CTS T4
Broker: Advantage Futures,
Trading: YM, ES, EU, US, S
Posts: 153 since Jun 2011
Thanks Given: 109
Thanks Received: 147

Software Programs:

OmniTrader (several hundred dollars - end of day edition) - got discouraged when losing signals would magically disappear and be replaced with winning signals each time you retrained the software.

Michael Harris's Pattern Finder (no longer available but cost $1000) - basically data mining for patterns. I've developed better stuff on my own since then, although I'm not sure whether machine-directed searches for market patterns has any long-term validity, as the risk of curve-fitting is high.

A couple of years ago, I bought some trader psychology software by Denise Shull for about $1,400. I went through it once and found it to be marginally helpful at the time, but I don't rely on any of her insights anymore. I would not recommend it.

Market System Analyzer by Michael Bryant - this is a good program (and reasonably priced) - if you want to test a particular model for whether it would benefit from dependency rules (that is, whether winners are followed by winners, etc.), equity curve trading, and different trade sizing methodologies. I would recommend it.

MultiCharts - one license for $1,400 - definitely worth it. Great program.

I am probably leaving something out but those are the big ones.


Gosh, too many to mention! Probably $3,000 - $5,000 in total. Not many were actually good.

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  #27 (permalink)
zer0's Avatar
Chicago, IL/USA
Experience: Advanced
Platform: CTS T4/Sierra Chart
Trading: Futures
Posts: 139 since Jun 2011
Thanks Given: 49
Thanks Received: 205

I'm happy to say that I have never spent a dime purchasing trading software of any kind. That is, unless you count Microsoft Excel. I do have to pay monthly fees for a platform however...

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  #28 (permalink)
Currently Inactive
Posts: 24 since Aug 2011

I purchased Tradestation 2000i for $2,400 shortly after it was released.

Used it for about 9 months, did the annual license update once, then threw it back into the box. Ouch!

I would probably like some of the new products if they have walk forward testing so that I can see the system entries/exits on the charts in multiple timeframes. That is what I really want out of a backtest.

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  #29 (permalink)
harvester's Avatar
Houston, Texas USA
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, MultiCharts, TradeStation, NeuroShell, AmiBroker
Broker: Interactive Brokers, TradeStation, DTN/IQ
Trading: TF, EMD, NQ, CL
Posts: 30 since Mar 2011
Thanks Given: 12
Thanks Received: 91

I really don't know where to start except at the beginning (this is almost embarrasing to recount)...

Online Trading Acadamy (2002 version) - free (borrowed from friend) - fairly useful at the time
TradeStation Easy Language Boot Camp - $1500 (including all expenses to Florida) - Very useful
John Carter - $1200 - Indicators/Training CDs - Useful info at the time, don't use the indicators anymore
Hawkeye Gold Package - $3700 - decent/basic indicators, but don't use them anymore
Hawkeye Training Cruise - $2500 - Great trip, learned things that I still use today, very good time with Nigel
Artemis for MetaTrader - $900 - Made all $900 back and more, stopped using after they stopped optimizing
Hawkeye for eSignal - Free - wasn't any better with eSignal
TradersExpo (3 trips) - $2500 (in travel expenses) - Prefer to surf websites now, and avoid the TSA searches...
NeuroShell DayTrader Pro - $3700 - The best optimizer/WFO around, use it for uncommon indicators almost daily
Chaos Hunter - $1200 - Very advanced tool, but haven't devoted much time with it yet
NeuroShell Advanced Seminar - $3000 (course+expenses) - Quite informative, much of the material made more sense two years after hearing it.
NeoTicker - $1100 - Very interesting capabilities, but don't care for the user interface or support/user group
AmiBroker64 - $300 - Probably just as powerful as NeoTicker, just haven't had time to explore all the features
Custom TradeStation strategies and indicators - $3000 - still use some of them daily
MetaTrader custom EA's - Free (I created them) - Use them from time to time, not too crazy about MT4
NinjaTrader7 - Free (with PFG) - The best platform I have - use it every day.
Novy Training w/NeoTicker - $4000 - 5 month interactive course that helped change my trading habits
SuriNotes ABC - $800 - This is very handy in the TradeStation platform, with RadarScreen on long term trades
SuriNotes CMI - $600 - A bit disappointed with this one - other things for free do better
NoxaPredict for NeuroShell - $500 - spent a year with this indie, I'm starting to learn them finally!
Bowfort ZeroLag/Wave for NeuroShell - $600 - These rival Jurik and are great in NeuroShell
Jurik for TradeStation - $600 - One of my main indicator sets - use them daily on Forex (JMA and CFB)
EminiScalp - $900 - a complete unbelievable ripoff and waste of money - cannot forgive myself on this one
EminiWatch Better Indicators - $600 - Very well done, love listening to the regular videos
EminiMethods for Sierra Charts - $1100 - I really liked reading through this material and using Sierra, but re-wrote these (myself) into TradeStation
Zunaa - $3800 - VWAP, DPOC, and other interesting goodies. Use the VWAP/StdDev constantly!

Books: I have about 50-60 books/kindle - Amazon loves me!

I've had TASC for years, and read through almost every article, and use some of the free indicators

Should mention that I bought RSKSys for $5000, but promptly got a refund - complete disappointment!

Not sure I feel any better now, but I suppose that was my tuition into this business. Even from the failures and ripoffs, there was something to be learned. Amazingly, I'm finding extremely simple systems (daily forex with a 30 SMA for example) to be profitable on long term trades.


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  #30 (permalink)
Fat Tails's Avatar
 Fat Tails 
Berlin, Europe
Market Wizard
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, MultiCharts
Broker: Interactive Brokers
Trading: Keyboard
Posts: 9,888 since Mar 2010
Thanks Given: 4,242
Thanks Received: 27,075

I am quite impressed how many software programs exist that I have never heard of.

I have evaluated some software packages without purchasing (Amibroker, MultiCharts, MetaTrader, VisualChart, ProRealTime, ButtonTrader, Bracket Trader and others), but there have been few packages for which I have actually spent money.
This is what I have paid for

- annual subscription for Quotetracker, until 2007 ($ 60)
- license for NinjaTrader ($ 995)
- membership for Big Mike's Trading Forum

The last investment had the highest returns.

I am fond of reading trading books and books on economy, and I am a subscriber to the Financial Times, TASC (Technical Analysis of Stocks and Commodities) and Active Trader. I admit that I have spent about $ 3500 on books related to trading, finance, economics, econophysics, statistics and game theory. Amazon loves me, and I do not regret the money spent. I would purchase about 75% of those books again, about 25% were a waste of money.

Software is not an answer to trading questions, it is just a tool. In an orchestra you cannot play different instruments at the same time (I am playing music). Mastering one instrument requires to focus on that instrument. Mastering one software package already takes a lot of time, and that is the reason that I have not yet engaged in playing around with another one. I plan to get a license for MultiCharts though, not because I believe that it is better, but because it is an alternative and may reduce my dependency on NinjaTrader. I don't want to stand on one leg forever.

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