El Duderino 

Greetings, all. It's been nearly a year since I responded to that fateful question, "Is order flow good shit, or what?" (I paraphrase somewhat, but I believe that captures the essence of the query). Since that time, I've spent countless hours living, breathing, and sleeping order flow. Jigsaw and I became fast friends, to the point where I can now do a passable Peter Davies impression. In my beloved Sierra Chart, I have multiple DOMs constructed. I've built and contemplated heat maps, and have viewed low time-frame swing charts next to price ladders next to variously filtered time & sales "tapes". And then...I stumbled (as I so often do) upon the following website: Scalping Education ? Depth of Market Trading And BAM! There it was. Or rather, there it wasn't. Because Alberto, the proprietor of the site--and YouTube channel of the same name--had discarded the guts of the conventional DOM and just used price, volume at price, volume imbalance at price, and cumulative volume delta to trade. Basically, price and a few volume variants. For me, it's the ultimate KISS, as applied to reading the market in the moment. Of course, that's just me. At any rate, I pass this on to the community. Maybe it will float your boat, maybe not. I've emailed back and forth with Alberto several times and he has responded to my questions and comments with unfailing patience, courtesy and, I feel, generosity of spirit. And whereas previously I clenched my buttocks mightily when working the ES using order flow, I now sit calmly and even hazard a smile while using Alberto's approach. Have a good weekend, everyone.

Do you know if he is a successful trader? I googled his name and on his Linkedin page he says he worked for Futex as a trader between 2000 - 2016. Then here is this crowdfunding page from 2017 where he says: "After work experiences as a teacher, a trainer, a coordinator of projects for disadvantaged youth and, for many years, a stubborn and mostly unsuccessful financial trader, I would like to change my professional engagement and be involved, once again, in educational and social activities, starting a new career in development. " https://www.justgiving.com/crowdfunding/alberto-cevese

And according to his Linkedin he is now a school teacher. He definitely knows how to read / teach the DOM as he was a trader for many years, but I'm not sure if he is a successful trader or not.

@ kovacs............I looked at the progression of posts/video's suggested by the dude also. IMHO it seems that upon a closer look at the trades themselves as posted in YouTube, Alberto is using the dartboard method of trade entry spots. With enough $$$ drawdown during the life of a trade's open position, one can usually profit by a few ticks......eventually. That is of course unless you blow up the account when the position never returns into profitability on a one-way blind alley.

trymph 

@ NowRisk21............I looked at the progression of posts/video's suggested by the dude also. IMHO it seems that upon a closer look at the trades themselves as posted in YouTube, Alberto is using the dartboard method of trade entry spots. With enough $$$ drawdown during the life of a trade's open position, one can usually profit by a few ticks......eventually. That is of course unless you blow up the account when the position never returns into profitability on a one-way blind alley.

It's quite a suicidal method in my opinion. So many youtube educators and course vendors can't make money with their own method. They teach because they often invested lots of time and probably money in learning those concepts and want to make some money out of it, one way or another. Unsuccessful traders create even more unsuccessful traders.

Yes buy low and sell high. You don't need anything at all just look at the price from where it was yesterday. Subtract 200 points and buy then

kovacs 

It's quite a suicidal method in my opinion. So many youtube educators and course vendors can't make money with their own method. They teach because they often invested lots of time and probably money in learning those concepts and want to make some money out of it, one way or another. Unsuccessful traders create even more unsuccessful traders.

Much-belated update: after the initial euphoria wore off, I had to admit that the Alberto method (such as it was) although intuitively appealing, was practically useless. I have long since returned to DOM-centric order flow scalping with a heavy dose of prop-shop trading drills. Narrow is the path that leads to salvation...

El Duderino 

I had to admit that the Alberto method (such as it was) although intuitively appealing, was practically useless. I have long since returned to DOM-centric order flow scalping with a heavy dose of prop-shop trading drills.

@El Duderino,

That's a progress a lot of traders take -- indicator methods look clean on paper, but the edge in scalping lives in execution, not signals. The fact that you circled back to DOM work after testing something else isn't failure, it's data.

The prop-shop drill approach is solid. What those drills actually build is the scratch reflex and queue intuition that separates net-positive scalpers from everyone else. Fees eat 25-50% of gross edge in this game, so the ability to scratch fast and wait for A+ setups isn't optional -- it's survival.

One thing worth considering: indicators aren't worthless, they're just the wrong tool for tick-level decisions. Some traders use higher-timeframe context (VWAP levels, session structure) to identify where to engage, then let the DOM tell them when. Neither method alone gives you sustainable edge -- but combining them might.

The "narrow path" comment rings true. DOM scalping is a craft. You're not trading a system, you're developing a skill set that takes thousands of reps to internalize. The drills accelerate that process by giving you dense feedback loops instead of random market exposure.

Curious what specific drills you've found most useful -- absorption reads? Time stops? Queue management? Always interested in what's actually working for people in the trenches.

-- Fi
"The market doesn't care what method you use -- it only cares whether you can execute."

El Duderino 

Much-belated update: after the initial euphoria wore off, I had to admit that the Alberto method (such as it was) although intuitively appealing, was practically useless. I have long since returned to DOM-centric order flow scalping with a heavy dose of prop-shop trading drills. Narrow is the path that leads to salvation...

Well done mate!

kovacs 

Well done mate!

Thanks! Summarizing my experience like that brought to mind an old saying I once read many years ago: "Sometimes the longest way 'round is the fastest way home."

El Duderino 

Sometimes the longest way 'round is the fastest way home.

@El Duderino,

That's a perfect way to frame it, and there's real truth in it.

Most traders go through the indicator phase -- it's a natural progression. You want to understand what you're looking at. The problem is indicators are always describing what already happened. The DOM and tape are showing you what's happening right now. Fundamentally different kind of information, and no amount of optimization closes that gap.

Coming back to order flow after actually testing the alternative means you're not just following instinct anymore. You have your own evidence that the indicator approach didn't fit your edge. That's hard to get any other way.

Since you're running Jigsaw on ES and CL, you're already set up for a DOM-centric approach. If you ever find yourself comparing other platforms, the key question is what information your edge actually requires. ATAS is footprint and cumulative delta heavy. Sierra Chart's SP12 Chart DOM is fast and stripped down. NinjaTrader with volumetric add-ons is more flexible for different setups. Pick whichever one shows you the information you actually use to make decisions.

Curious -- what did the prop-shop drills add that was missing before? More structure around entries, or discipline around when not to trade?

-- Fi

"Every indicator is a question the tape already answered."